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hosted_by_rootsweb.gif - 2319 Bytes Ann's Ancestors: Winder Name Origins

The Winder Surname

by Richard S. Winder

General origins

The Winder surname has several different origins, depending on the source that you consult or the particular family involved. Hand-in-hand with that, it can be pronounced different ways (long or short "i") and there are several variations in spelling. One recent branch of my Winder family recently changed their spelling to Wynder to force people to pronounce the name with the long "i"; spellings may have gone back and forth over the centuries for this reason. The name is found throughout Europe, but it is not common. It has, of course, moved around the world with European colonial activity. According to the U.S. Census Bureau, there were only 88,799 living Winders in the U.S. in 1996 (0.002% of the population, or two out of every 10,000 people). There were 6,457 last names more common than Winder in America at that point in time (1).

Origins in Lancaster and Cumbria

Timeline

In Lancashire, England, Winder (also Wynder or Wender in earlier forms) is regarded as having both place name and occupational origins clearly stretching back to at least the 13th century, for example Wiliam de Wynder of Wynder born ca. 1278 (2). In Cumbria, there were two Winder Halls. The first was situated in Lorton, Cockermouth, Cumbria, and was built in the 13th century and is currently a hotel. These Winders then moved 30 miles east to build a 2nd hall in Penrith, Cumbria (3). There may be earlier instances in other areas of England. One person has informed me that there is a citation in the Domesday book, a census that was compiled shortly after the Norman conquest, but I have not yet located that citation. Other sources list William de Fitzgerald de Windor, b. ca.1083 at Carew Castle, Wales, son of Geraldus de Windor and Nesta Reese (2).

Occupational vs. Place origins

When the name is pronounced with a long vowel (like the word 'why') the common story of origin is that the name is derived from the occupation of winding thread (4), yarn (5) or other types of cordage (6). In 1800s census records for the British Isles, it is common to see occupations such as winder, bobbin winder, yarn winder, warp winder, linen winder, etc. listed. Genealogists cite Thomas le Winder and Richard le Windere as early examples of the occupational name in Lancashire, an area where sheep and wool-related enterprises are common. The first definition found in the 1971 Oxford Compact Dictionary has some interesting historical citations for textile winders:

"An operative employee in winding wool, etc. Huloet, 1552: "Wynder of thread or yarne..."; Silkwormes, 1559: "What need I count now how many winders liue, how many twisters eke, and weauers thrive vpon this trade."; Chas. II Act 4 c.15, 1662: "Whereas there is a necessity lying upon the silke throwers to deliver to their winders or doublers considerable quantities of silke."; Nottingham, 1751: "Almost every seamer, sizer, and winder will have her tea."; Committee Ribbon Wearers 1818: "What can a common winder earn? 3 shillings. What a quill winder- Four shillings."; York 1828: "If they take away their work from carders and spinners, they return it back to them threefold as winders, warpers, weavers."; Cassells Techn. Edu. VIII 1879: The Winder, who put the silk, cotton, or thread on the bobbins."

But other Winder families in Lancashire may originate from one of three places in the area named Winder, principally a place near Cartmel which has existed since the 13th century. This is shown in the 13th century by the existence of the early form "de Wynder" or "de Winderghe" (7). It's not clear to me if these forms would have been pronounced with the long or short "i". One person has told me that when Winder is pronounced with a short vowel in Lancashire, it may stem from a place name that derives from an old Norse term for "shelter" (8).

There is another complication. If the name refers to textile winding (from the Anglo-Saxon word windan*), a winder worked alongside a master weaver at a loom. In the 1300s, such people were usually male apprentices because weaving was a primarily a cottage industry, and they usually took 'Prentice' as a surname, or took the name of the master weaver (9) (or they became a weaver). So, the surname probably predates the occupation in many cases. That wouldn't preclude some earlier forms of Winder derived from instances where winding was pursued as a separate specialty business, especially for cordage.

*The surnames "Winders", "Windes", "Windows", and "Windus", although possibly related to Winder, might also derive from windhouse (windmill), especially in the case of Windus. See citations below.

Other origins

So, where does the long vowel form of the name come from? It could be simply a corruption of the short vowel form; we can probably expect to find some cases where shifts in pronunciation occurred in either direction over the centuries. However, there are other possibilities. One source has told me that tradition in England is that the long vowel form of Winder actually derives from an ancient Anglo-Saxon term meaning "he (or she) of narrow street" (3).

Another point to keep in mind is that coal was often mined in this area of England. The 1971 Compact Oxford Dictionary lists this possibility and others:

(Long vowel)

1. One who turns or manages a winch or windlass, especially at a mine- a windlass man. Hooson Miner's Dictionary 1747: "Upon the stoblade which the Winder stands to draw at..." Ann. Reg. (1821) 1869: "The miners in the work, and the winders at the mouth of the pit."; Edin. Rev. Jan. 1899: "Coalowners cannot work their mines without hewers and winders.".

2. One who winds a clock or other mechanism. Voy. and mem. midshipman 1837: "William aspired sometime ago to the honor of winding up the chronometers, when Mr. Graves, the regular winder, happened to be absent."; Instr. Census Clerks 1885: "Jobber and winder (clock)..." *

*I would discount this derivation as a likely surname origin, since clocks are relatively recent developments.

3. One who blows a wind instrument. Cornett�ro 1611 "A coronet maker or winder..."; Endym 1818: "Winder of the horn, when snouted wild-boars tender corn anger our huntsmen" **.

**Pronunciation of this form can be either with the short vowel, or, in more archaic forms, with the long vowel. Looking at the etymology listed in some dictionaries, it seems that the spiral construction of a hunting horn and the action of blowing your "wind" into such a horn were associated with each other.

(Short vowel)

1. A winnower (separating chaff from the grain during threshing). Sterm. 1570: "Mowers, threshers, winders, and grinders...".

2. In early Flemish, a widgeon (also wender).

Origins elsewhere

In England and Germany, the name may also derive from Windhere, refering to a Wend warrior (10). The Wends were a tribe living roughly between what is now the Czech Republic and the Baltic Sea, the people chiefly responsible for halting the Mongol expansion in that area.

In Germany, there are several listed origins for the surname (11) {English translation in brackets}:

"Winder a) I. S. Winid {Wend}, b) III. Arbeiter an einem Krane {Crane or windlass worker}. Zss. Garnwinder {Yarn winder} 'Netzflechter' {Net maker?}."

Citations

(1) U.S. Census Bureau, 1996, http://www.census.gov/genealogy/www/namesearch.html
(2) Mormon I.G.I., quoted by Liz Winder ([email protected]).
(3) Steve Winder 2000. E-mail correspondence ([email protected])
(4) Mark A. Lower. 1860. Patryonymica Britannica: A dictionary of the family names of the United Kingdom. John Russel Smith, London.
(5) Anonymous. 1971. The Compact edition of the Oxford English Dictionary, Oxford Univ. Press, London.
(6) Charles W. Bardsley, 1884. English surnames: Their sources and significations. Chatto & Windus, London.
(7) Richard McKinley. 1981. English surnames series: IV The surnames of Lancashire. Leopard's Head Press, London.
(8) Bob Winder. 1997. E-mail correspondence. Bolton, England.
(9) J. R. Dolan. 1972. English ancestral names: The evolution of the surname from medieval occupations. Clarkson N. Potter, Inc., N.Y.
(10) Henry Barber. 1902. British family names: Their meaning and origin. Elliot Stock, London.
(11) A. Heintze and P. Cascorbe. 1967. Die deutschen familiennamen geschichtlich, geographisch, sprachlich. Georg Olms Verlagsbuchhanndlung, Hildsheim.

If you have / want further information, please contact me at [email protected]

Finally: Please do not copy any of this material without my permission. I have quoted fellow researchers liberally, with their permission, and only they have the right to publish their material. For more about copyrights, see Copyright Discussion.

This page was last modified on 4 Oct 2001